Movables

A place to talk about the Geocaching Australia dragonZone and other games
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budgietas
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Movables

Post by budgietas » 19 April 21 4:37 pm

I think this is a very very good idea, so thought I would break it out of the Blitz game thread
Post by gooseandegg » 18 April 21 8:58 pm

A lot of movables sit dormant for most of the year, and even get archived because admin thinks they are lost of missing, and then they suddenly appear in droves when there is a game on. I'll get shot down from all angles, but personally I think GCA would be better without movables. 8-[ GCA has so much more going for it with all the other various cache types, especially trig points, that GC don't recognize.
But yeah I know the trouble is most players have found all the local geocaches so need the movables to get some kind of find to compete in the games. If movables only counted as a find and earnt points when a MOVE was made, rather than a find, they would be treated differently (and correctly). And yes I admit I am as 'guilty' as anyone else but when they are under your nose you don't refuse, especially in this case where it helps every player. :-#
The issue with movables is they tend to get found in lumps - and like Goose I am guilty of this as much as anyone. Also there are people that like to find movables only once so get no points when they move a movable to another area.

I dont know if this is possible, but can we change moveables where you only get Dragonzone points for the move. I would also say the move has to be more than say 50 metres from a previous hiding spot to get the points. You are still able to move to a common spot if you like, but no dragonzone points for that

This would encourage people to move these caches as originally intended and not just "spot in the hands off"

Dragonzone Guardian, is this possible?

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caughtatwork
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Re: Movables

Post by caughtatwork » 20 April 21 9:54 am

A cache that only accumulates points on a move will get moved from S37 45.000 E144 45.000 to S37 45.000 E144 45.001. There, now I've "moved it" but it's still in the same place for others to find "in the hands of". We tried in a previous game where the cache had to move more than 1km. At a major event people "moved it" 1km, then someone else "moved it back".

Friends will hand it to "friends" and back to get around the 2 or 3 finds between your own finds. People will "rehide" it on the other side of Port Philip Bay and when someone actually goes there, they find the caches were never even there, they were only "moved" to rack up points and in fact are still in the back seat of their car.

Unscrupulous people will be unscrupulous and so while moveables will remain part of the games because they are physical geocaches. We all know people cheat and if they're too egregious they get DQ'd from the games.

Whether moveable caches should remain as part of the site or not is kind of a moot point, because as far as the developers go, we're not going to remove them. If we took away every cache type that someone or other didn't like, we wouldn't even have traditional caches because they're "boring and I don't like looking for boring geocaches". Everyone dislikes something about something.

budgietas
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Re: Moveables

Post by budgietas » 20 April 21 2:31 pm

Hi CaughtatWork

I certainly dont want moveables removed, just suggesting another option that might work. Moveables do tend to get found and sit in peoples cars for a while and I think Goose was just suggesting a way of getting them moved on quicker.

Luckyl10n
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Re: Movables

Post by Luckyl10n » 20 April 21 5:29 pm

As one of those that only logs a cache find once on a cache (not sure if I'm in the minority here or not?), could I suggest that for dragonZone purposes perhaps points should only accrue for the first unique find for any cache, i.e. trigs, trads. multis, moveables etc etc etc. That would allow those who wish to log multiple finds to continue to do so (I know of a number of cachers who did this with moveables prior to the advent of dragonZone and I expect will continue regardless of whether they accrue dragonZone points or not), while eliminating the skewing of games and levels by points harvesting off moveables. When I "find" and move a moveable a second, third or fourth time I simply log a "Note" to let others know I have it and then a "Move" once its back out again. Interested in what others think.
LL

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caughtatwork
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Re: Movables

Post by caughtatwork » 22 April 21 11:18 am

The "rule" of a moveable cache is that once it has been hidden, you can find it again. Whether you personally feel that you shouldn't log multiple finds, well that's your game to play. Of course that also means you could log 50 finds on the one traditional cache down the street and make your targets. If you would like to be that silly, then it's up to you, but I would expect you would feel some level of heat from the community as not being in the spirit of the game.

I would not like to exclude multiple finds on geocaches as being eligible in the general game of dZ (although specific games may count differently). GC headed down that road a few years ago and it simply adds more rules to their game of which there are already far too many.

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Just a cacher
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Re: Movables

Post by Just a cacher » 22 April 21 6:39 pm

LuckyL10n: I don't mind finding a movable more than once, as long as it has been moved so it's a 'new' location, and therefore a 'new' find - that's my personal preference. I don't mind how others play, though. I certainly don't think it's very sporting to find non-moving caches multiple times.

Luckyl10n
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Re: Movables

Post by Luckyl10n » 23 April 21 1:03 pm

Hi C@W and JAC

JAC, you and BB and rogerw3 are some of the cachers I had in mind when I talked about cachers who have always collected moveables and moved them on, regardless of dZ, and who I don't think would be particularly affected by limiting dZ points to the first find on these type of caches, as this is how you have always played the game. I also acknowledge that you are all also regular hiders of new caches, regardless of whether there is a game on to encourage that activity or not.

My suggestion is aimed at limiting the effect of those moveables which only seem to circulate whenever a game is on, as I think it skews the outcome as well as inflating the levels on the "league table". I'm quite happy with the way I choose to play the game, but I am a bit disappointed that this loop hole seems to get exploited at game time. I acknowledge that from time to time there will be different groups of cachers who feel they are at a disadvantage in respect of a particular game, but it also seems to me that the administrators try very hard to level out the playing field, even to the extent of crafting the next game to try to iron out any wrinkles identified in the previous round. I currently have 88 unfound caches in my home state/territory and maybe a similar number within a reasonable travel time from home, which means my participation will be limited at times too, which I accept as being part of the game. I also know I can travel further afield if I choose to to improve my standing in any particular game period.

I think if dZ points were restricted as per my earlier suggestion, it would actually encourage players on GCA to hide more caches, including new moveables, between games so there was plenty of fodder available for everybody during the next game. Just my thoughts on it.

Cheers
LL

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