The final nail in the "moveables" coffin

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Mind Socket
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The final nail in the "moveables" coffin

Post by Mind Socket » 26 July 03 2:05 pm

Someone reignited the Groundspeak topic entitled "Since when do we allow moving caches?".

This prompted the following response from Jeremy(tm):
No moving caches. My original post was not about the irresponsibility of placing moving caches without approval from local land managers(which is definitely an issue). It's the issue of placing a one time only cache, where the first finder takes it and moves it elsewhere.

We have addressed this to death. If you don't like it, create your own moving caches web site and get folks to be irresponsible there. Some topics are not decided by committee.

If this comes up again, feel free to point anyone to this post. I doubt I'll address it again.

Jeremy Irish
Groundspeak - The Language of Location(tm)
My response:
That's a shame. "Placing a one time only cache, where the first finder takes it and moves it elsewhere" doesn't have to be an issue. Is there any evidence that badly placed, yet approved, regular caches are less prevalent than well placed moveables that have since been banned? There have been no problems in NSW, Australia, where at least 6 moveables have been providing something different for a while.

It takes a certain type of person to be irresponsible, not a certain type of cache.

Ok, ok, I'll shut up. I know it's your site and your rules, I just hope it's well understood how this attitude looks to some people. I'll take this as a final, not-so-subtle hint that I need to call what I do something other than geocaching, as the name doesn't mean what it used to, to me. I know the old argument, gc != gc.com, but you can't separate the two anymore, and gc.com has implicitly assumed a responsibility.

Yours in looking forward,
Roger / Mind Socket
There's more stuff from other people in the thread at GroundSpeak.

What do people think, not about moveables, about the general issue of rules? It's a multi-faceted topic, that's for sure.

- Mind Socket

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ideology
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Post by ideology » 27 July 03 10:41 pm

well, it's his site and he can make whatever rules he wants
one problem with rules is that they multiply to cover every instance
in the end you get huge volumes which noone can understand (eg tax)

being the capitalists that we are, we'd rather leave it to the invisible hand of market forces
with proper voting and feedback systems, we think the standard of caches would improve dramatically
it's on our list of things to do when we get a chance

in the meantime, why not explore the world of Nomic!

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EcoTeam
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Post by EcoTeam » 28 July 03 2:19 am

I have to agree that it's his site and his rules, that's life.
I have not followed the entire argument, as it seems to be US based, but I'm sure Jeremy has some really good reasons for baning movable cahes. I for one am willing to respect his opinion on this. If it wasn't for Jeremy and gc.com, geocaching as we know it today probably wouldn't exist. I think it's worth cutting him some slack.
When I started geocaching it was little more than a tupperware box in the bush, but now it's so much more, innovative cache ideas are coming out every week. There are endless possibilities when it comes to new cache ideas, so baning moveable caches is hardly going to stiffle any innovation as far as I can see.

Regards
EcoDave :)
P.S. Yes, I'm not the biggest fan of moveable caches, but I am trying to be impartial here.

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EcoTeam
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Post by EcoTeam » 28 July 03 11:29 pm

Re. the rating system.
Yes that's a tough call. It would have to be anonymous to work I suppose, as the current log system allows you to say whatever you like publically.
Bad reports may indeed make people remove caches, and that would be a shame, as just about everyone has a different opinion on just about every cache. Just look at the NSW cache awards last year, the results were so smeared out over dozens of caches that there was little difference between 1st and last place.

EcoDave :)

Mind Socket
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Post by Mind Socket » 29 July 03 10:25 am

Agreed, but a rating system could be set up to prevent this. People could give a general rating /10 and their usual log (including spoilers that can be properly hidden from non-finders) and only be encouraged to mentioning problems if there really is one. The existing logging is part way there in a way.

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