DNF on muggled caches
- Richary
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Re: DNF on muggled caches
If I have looked and not found I will post a DNF. I'm not ashamed of my DNFs. If I have got to the spot and seen the number of muggles or something else preventing me from searching then I will either post a note or nothing. The note at least lets the hider know someone was interested in it, especially if it is out of town and doesn't get that many visits.
That said, I won't generally post multiple DNFs on the one cache even if I have had a few looks at different times.
I agree, people should post their DNFs as a way of letting the owner know there may be a problem and the cache needs checking. If nobody puts a DNF log then how does the owner know the cache is gone, rather than just being temporarily unloved?
I have one cache a bit across town from home where the most recent log is a DNF, and it should be easy to find. That said it has had a couple of DNFs in a row before from other searchers in the past but a check showed all was well. So I won't race over to Manly just to check it on the basis of 1 DNF, if I see 2-3 in a row, especially from experienced finders then I will make it a priority to get over there on the next free weekend. So those who don't find it and don't log that either as a DNF or a note aren't doing anyone else any favours.
Back to the OP as well, changing your log type on GC after it has rolled into the GCA stats generator won't change the log type based on something C@W said recently in another thread. So you would need to delete the log and re enter it from scratch to change the type.
That said, I won't generally post multiple DNFs on the one cache even if I have had a few looks at different times.
I agree, people should post their DNFs as a way of letting the owner know there may be a problem and the cache needs checking. If nobody puts a DNF log then how does the owner know the cache is gone, rather than just being temporarily unloved?
I have one cache a bit across town from home where the most recent log is a DNF, and it should be easy to find. That said it has had a couple of DNFs in a row before from other searchers in the past but a check showed all was well. So I won't race over to Manly just to check it on the basis of 1 DNF, if I see 2-3 in a row, especially from experienced finders then I will make it a priority to get over there on the next free weekend. So those who don't find it and don't log that either as a DNF or a note aren't doing anyone else any favours.
Back to the OP as well, changing your log type on GC after it has rolled into the GCA stats generator won't change the log type based on something C@W said recently in another thread. So you would need to delete the log and re enter it from scratch to change the type.
Re: DNF on muggled caches
A DNF log dosn't bother me but obviously it's importent to some, I saw the profile of an overseas cacher that had over 1000 finds and zero DNF's.I seem to run about 1 in 10.Maybe we should have a DNF Pathtag to commemorate 50 or 100 DNF's.
- ruzzelz
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Re: DNF on muggled caches
One in 10 seems about right I hope my ratio stays around thatbig dazza wrote:A DNF log dosn't bother me but obviously it's importent to some, I saw the profile of an overseas cacher that had over 1000 finds and zero DNF's.I seem to run about 1 in 10.Maybe we should have a DNF Pathtag to commemorate 50 or 100 DNF's.
- pprass
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Re: DNF on muggled caches
So out of the 15 individual replies, 14 said "No" and just 1 said "Yes", but qualified it with a "play the game as you like to" comment, so reluctantly it is disqualified
A unanimous caching community opinion (for this sample) which is interesting as it shows that cachers do not place any stigmas on a DNF record and find the information useful and informative - which is as it should be.
I suggest though that not all cachers think this way as we have all seen logs (as Geodes mentioned) where cachers state after finally finding a tough cache (for them) that it was their 2nd, 3rd or even 4th attempt! I have even had emails from cachers asking for hints after they say that they have been trying for some time to find a cache - and not one DNF in sight.
I hope that it is discussions like these that will steer caching behavior to the standard that the responders hold.
ps - Lucy's comment is correct, but there are a lot of times when it is clearly obvious that the cache has gone - ie bits of log book scattered around, pen or pencil stuck in the ground, swaps and even a broken container in the vicinity.
A unanimous caching community opinion (for this sample) which is interesting as it shows that cachers do not place any stigmas on a DNF record and find the information useful and informative - which is as it should be.
I suggest though that not all cachers think this way as we have all seen logs (as Geodes mentioned) where cachers state after finally finding a tough cache (for them) that it was their 2nd, 3rd or even 4th attempt! I have even had emails from cachers asking for hints after they say that they have been trying for some time to find a cache - and not one DNF in sight.
I hope that it is discussions like these that will steer caching behavior to the standard that the responders hold.
ps - Lucy's comment is correct, but there are a lot of times when it is clearly obvious that the cache has gone - ie bits of log book scattered around, pen or pencil stuck in the ground, swaps and even a broken container in the vicinity.
- Apty
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Re: DNF on muggled caches
I have a confession. I'm one of the 'blighters' that doesn't log all my DNFs. Main reason: I'm LAZY! Sometimes, I'm not in the mood for searching & searching & searching! Esp if it's a micro on a cannon, or a micro / small that has been put out for no particular reason other than placing a cache. I'll have a quick look, decide to move on, and forget it.
Sorry!
That has been the way _I_ play the game, but as you guys seem passionate about this, I promise (a real promise, not an 'election promise' ) to try harder to log DNFs.
I have logged DNF if I've wanted to let the owner know something about the cache, like the one at Clayton Bay, South Aus which is 6m up a tree, and after I (who is afraid of heights ) climbed it I found a piece of velcro screwed to the tree which I assume is where the cache should be.
Sorry!
That has been the way _I_ play the game, but as you guys seem passionate about this, I promise (a real promise, not an 'election promise' ) to try harder to log DNFs.
I have logged DNF if I've wanted to let the owner know something about the cache, like the one at Clayton Bay, South Aus which is 6m up a tree, and after I (who is afraid of heights ) climbed it I found a piece of velcro screwed to the tree which I assume is where the cache should be.
- pprass
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Re: DNF on muggled caches
Thanks Apty for an honest response. We have on many occasions been in that same situation, but then we say it is better to let the owner know what we think.Apty wrote:....Esp if it's a micro on a cannon, or a micro / small that has been put out for no particular reason other than placing a cache. I'll have a quick look, decide to move on, and forget it.
Re: DNF on muggled caches
I have attempted and not found a cache 4 times in a row, but came back on the fifth time and found it. This was over 4 days or so and I reckon not looging a DNF in this case is fair - I just spent 4 days looking for it
- Team Wibble
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Re: DNF on muggled caches
Apty wrote:....Esp if it's a micro on a cannon, or a micro / small that has been put out for no particular reason other than placing a cache. I'll have a quick look, decide to move on, and forget it.
I think that's perfectly valid. If a cache is not worth searching for, for any length of time, then there's no need to log a DNF if you didn't put much effort into the search. Pretty similar to not logging a DNF because muggles prevented you from searching properly.
- ruzzelz
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Re: DNF on muggled caches
Sounds like a DNF, looks like a DNF, smells like a DNF, surely it tasted like a DNF after the fourth attempt.squalid wrote:I have attempted and not found a cache 4 times in a row, but came back on the fifth time and found it. This was over 4 days or so and I reckon not looging a DNF in this case is fair - I just spent 4 days looking for it
Replaced with the sweet taste of sucess on day five
Re: DNF on muggled caches
5 DNF's today. That brings the Freddo total to 678 DNFs!!!
Re: DNF on muggled caches
When we first started caching we were quite excited by having 0 DNF's as you know lol ...... but soon enough they started happening!!!!! lolol ..... anyway we have discussed this amongst our team just recently and our practice is if we cant search due to being interrupted by muggles or it starts pouring etc and we have to leave, we log a note (and go back another time) but if we search for a decent amount of time and especially if it is a cache that previous loggers have said "Easy Find" then we log a DNF so that the owner is alerted that we haven't been able to find it - as in the recent case of GEGP#3 of Geodes - otherwise he wouldn't have known to have to visit it to see if it was gone which it was. We havent worried about changing that DNF to a note even tho that cache wasnt there. Also we usually place a cache on watch after DNF'ing it to see if anyone else finds it after us (as has happened a couple of times and then we know we just didnt look hard enuf/in the right place lol) We have a couple in Wonthaggi and surrounds that we didnt find when we were down at Cape Patterson and have since had many finds so G&M will go looking for them next January lolpprass wrote:We have logged quite a few DNF's on caches that have been subsequently reported by the owner as being muggled. So my question is would you then go back and change the "DNF" log to a "Write a note" log? After all the cache wasn't actually there when we were searching so it isn't really a DNF. To me a DNF relates to an unsuccessful search for a cache that is actually there.
I know some cachers don't post DNF's as it ruins their stats (amongst other things!) so I'm thinking if it was acceptable or common to go back and change the status of your log, maybe more would be willing to post DNF's.
And with due respect, please don't say - "You play the game as you like to" I would like to know what you would do.
So to sum up - whilst originally we were like "Noooooooooooo" when we had to log our first DNF, our opinion now is it's important to do so to alert the owners of a potential missing cache but also keeping in mind that we might just be blind!!!! lol
GJMMelb (J)
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Re: DNF on muggled caches
as soon as I leave the house for geocaching there are only 2 options: Either I "Found it" or "Did not find" the cache.
Quite simple ... isn't it?
There is no "Write a log" cache-state if you tried to find it at one point.
just my 0.05 €
Quite simple ... isn't it?
There is no "Write a log" cache-state if you tried to find it at one point.
just my 0.05 €
- MtnLioness
- 2800 or more caches found
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Re: DNF on muggled caches
I agree that if you actually did some kind of search and did not come up with the goods, that warrants a DNF.
Bar some exceptions ~
If you just looked out your car window as you slowed down near to where you would park and decided that getting out wasn't going to be an option.
If you got muggled out.
If the container is obviously destroyed (there is evidence strewn about) as that simply needs a Needs maintenance log.
If you really just think you weren't looking hard enough and decide to come back relatively soon-ish. This last one only just gets the exception rule sometimes for me, it depends on a few things like time alloted to searching, weather or just over it for the day and I know I'll be back in the area some other time.
The other thing is I want to say is PLEASE...as a cache owner, Write in your DNFs and even your notes, if something is amiss or not quite right, tell us, it may be fine or it may be just the piece of info we need to make us do something about it! Those who don't like logging the DNFs purely based on it mucking up their stats are just Prideful and that's just stupid. (excepting those who are just lazy, even the self admitting ones!! ;P) They're not impressing anyone so what's the point?? Get over yourself!
Bar some exceptions ~
If you just looked out your car window as you slowed down near to where you would park and decided that getting out wasn't going to be an option.
If you got muggled out.
If the container is obviously destroyed (there is evidence strewn about) as that simply needs a Needs maintenance log.
If you really just think you weren't looking hard enough and decide to come back relatively soon-ish. This last one only just gets the exception rule sometimes for me, it depends on a few things like time alloted to searching, weather or just over it for the day and I know I'll be back in the area some other time.
The other thing is I want to say is PLEASE...as a cache owner, Write in your DNFs and even your notes, if something is amiss or not quite right, tell us, it may be fine or it may be just the piece of info we need to make us do something about it! Those who don't like logging the DNFs purely based on it mucking up their stats are just Prideful and that's just stupid. (excepting those who are just lazy, even the self admitting ones!! ;P) They're not impressing anyone so what's the point?? Get over yourself!
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Re: DNF on muggled caches
Nope. there are no exceptions.MtnLioness wrote:...Bar some exceptions ~
I log a DNF and tell verybody why it wasn't possible to get out of the car (heavy traffic, no secure parking spot, ...)MtnLioness wrote:If you just looked out your car window as you slowed down near to where you would park and decided that getting out wasn't going to be an option.
I most definitely log a DNF - if I look in the logs and see that a lot of people got disturbed by muggles I want to know that.MtnLioness wrote:If you got muggled out.
... and I also couldn't sign the log hence ... DNFMtnLioness wrote:If the container is obviously destroyed (there is evidence strewn about) as that simply needs a Needs maintenance log.
I even logged a DNF and the smiley at the same day since I couldn't find it in the morning and returned on the way home. This was due to muggles and it is a good hint if you know that there are a lot of muggles in the morning.MtnLioness wrote:If you really just think you weren't looking hard enough and decide to come back relatively soon-ish.
Yep couldn't agree more with this oneMtnLioness wrote:The other thing is I want to say is PLEASE...as a cache owner, Write in your DNFs and even your notes, if something is amiss or not quite right, tell us, it may be fine or it may be just the piece of info we need to make us do something about it!
- Bewilderbeest
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Re: DNF on muggled caches
There's no need to brag Im still 15 shy of my century, but I'm expecting to pick up a few more on my upcoming Qld tripFreddo wrote:5 DNF's today. That brings the Freddo total to 678 DNFs!!!