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What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016? 
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Post Re: What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
the Monkey King wrote:
Keeping the cache owner from needing to confirm a historical cache has been found is a good one, especially when the cache owner no longer caches or can't answer emails for what ever reason.

What follows isn't really that helpful, but might give someone better ideas on how to make a History Cache work:

If everyone had accesss to NFC (near field communication) devices this could solve the issue of arm chair loggers - An NFC chip can be loaded with information and even a link the web site needed to answer the history cache questions, and you need to be within about 12 cms to get that information.

This way someone has to visit the site to get the answers to the questions, and then tap their phone to the NFC chip to get a link to a web site were they can answer the questions.

Unfortunately no everyone will have a device that can use NFC, myself included. Some phones have them already, but not mine. (For a list of phones that do: http://www.nfcworld.com/nfc-phones-list/ )

So... back to square one.

I thought about folks needing to take a photo at GZ as part of the log, but I have seen a number of people make logs without adding the photo.

Another thought - if the historical site has a kiosk/information booth etc that is staffed, could asking the staff to hand out a question sheet to anyone asking them work? This would get muggles involved, but might be good for business so to speak. This way someone can only answer the questions by visiting the place to get the actual questions that need to be answered.

But it does have a flaw - not all historical sites have staff, and those that do wont have 24 hour access.

So it seems having a person visit a site and get a piece of information that can't be found via the internet might be the best way to do this.

As GCA doesn't have reviewers we need to rely on hiders doing the right thing in regards to picking a site for a History cache, so a clear set of guide lines would be needed - I am happy to knock up a draft idea for others to pull apart or add to if it would help.


NFC's are not pervasive enough to warrant use as a history cache. NFC caches can be implemented in the future, but of course you need to have a NFC device and the NFC needs to be purchased and needs to be programmed to return the right data. This is not quite as simple as some might imagine but it's not too difficult. Then you have a GPS user who can't find these cache types as they don't have the right device. Also related to this are hacks via NFC which may cause issues with your NFC device. Like a dead drop cache you can't guarantee the payload from an unknown device, so the risk of damage is (vanishingly small but) there. We looked at NFCs a few years ago and decided not to go ahead with them at that point. I think they're also more of a http://wiki.geocaching.com.au/wiki/Beacon_Cache than associated with a history cache.


11 January 16 8:27 am
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Post Re: What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
tronador wrote:
I would not be in favor of any cache type specifically relying on data access. The are a lot of us cachers using dedicated hand held gps devices and not smart phones. And I for one have no intentions of ever phone caching.

There will come a time where some cache types are only accessible via means other than a GPS. WhereIGo is one example. My intention is to reach as many geocachers as possible, but I'm certainly not going to restrict a great idea because some people can't find the cache due to technology. I can't find 5/5 caches due to my body. Person X can't find a certain cache because they don't have the right technology. Same thing. Someone is disadvantaged and not everyone can find every cache.


11 January 16 8:30 am
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Post Re: What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
ziggiau wrote:
I love my NSW survey markers, but loading a map with 3927 finds can get quite laggy. Is there a way to better manage the locationless caches that have volume like this? I use the map to check if the marker has already been logged to save time when logging. Otherwise I create the log, find a clash, then have to delete.

Or maybe a search facility by coords for locationless (I know this is available for regular caches)?

And is there a way that you can farm out some of the mundane tasks that you guys do to free your time up to do the stuff that the rest of us can't do? Spread the load? I know I'm going to spend more time on the wiki this year because that's something I can manage.

This has been added to the developer list which are things we will do when we have time. I've dragged it out of here as a specific item for development so it doesn't get lost.
http://wiki.geocaching.com.au/wiki/Geoc ... List#Ideas


11 January 16 8:34 am
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Post Re: What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
WazzaAndWenches wrote:
I love the idea of History Cache. Particularly if there is a timeout and multiple question/answer possibilities.

Geocaching Australia wrote:
What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
1. The ability to add gallery items during the log stage rather than as an extra few steps.
2. An app for "i" devices. Yep, I know someone external is currently playing around with a new GC app and is looking into adding GCA functionality. The sooner, the better.

1. Has been added to the developer list for attention as it's a simple stand alone request. http://wiki.geocaching.com.au/wiki/Geoc ... List#Ideas


11 January 16 8:35 am
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Post Re: What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
Laighside Legends wrote:
Just had an idea...

Would it be possible to get stats on just the caches returned from a query? (think along the lines of setting a query in GSAK and then running FindStatGen) But this could be extended beyond just found caches. Could be used to answer questions along the lines of, of the caches in the zone x which has the most finds?, what percentage of SA's caches are micros?, In which month were the most events held?, Of the caches hidden by x and found by me what percentage are puzzles?, and so on...

Not sure if any of that is possible but it seemed like a good idea...

Great idea. Not sure how feasible it is. The stats produced at the moment can't be added to by the user. They are all coded by the developers. Adding in a MyQuery to the same stats is conceptually feasible. Adding other stats is not something I can think of as to how it can be done. You are talking about an open query engine which I wouldn't know how to implement. There's also a huge risk that a malformed query can hang the DB. At least using GSAK you only hang your own PC. Obviously you can get the data you want in the raw form by the query, you just can't use GCA to manipulate it to derive additional statistics. Maybe for the arcane queries you need to go to GSAK and import the query data from GCA and then write / run your own macros? Dunno. This is an interesting discussion.


11 January 16 8:41 am
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Post Re: What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
petan wrote:
the Monkey King wrote:
Keeping the cache owner from needing to confirm a historical cache has been found is a good one, especially when the cache owner no longer caches or can't answer emails for what ever reason.


Although having said that, the owner still needs to be involved - things change, information signs disappear or are redesigned and in the case of a certain building in my home town may disappear completely.

Quote:
This way someone has to visit the site to get the answers to the questions, and then tap their phone to the NFC chip to get a link to a web site were they can answer the questions.


If you really wanted to go down that path why not go for a QR code - these are already used on this site. Personally I'd prefer to keep the cache information and the facility to log it together. Remembering the Earthcache model which inspired this - I go to the history cache site, (hopefully) I have read the cache description, I have my list of questions to answer, I can choose to either answer them on site using my phone data or take some notes and log them at home on wifi. As a finder of this kind of cache I would prefer to log at home.

Quote:
As GCA doesn't have reviewers we need to rely on hiders doing the right thing in regards to picking a site for a History cache, so a clear set of guide lines would be needed - I am happy to knock up a draft idea for others to pull apart or add to if it would help.


I'd be happy to help with this. Might be good to take this to a thread of its own and any others who wish to be part of this conversation can be included.It also means that anyone who just wants to submit a general 'wish' for 2016 can do so without getting swamped by History Cache discussion.



QR codes are Munzees :-)
They are also known as BIT Caches which the Senate rejected as a cache type in the last 12 months.
Forcing a QR Code up on a history cache would restrict the folks who can find them. As the Senate has rejected QRCodes as a cache type, they can be used as a tool (like attaching to your movable caches for each look up ion the field), but they can't right now, be used as an integral part of a new cache type.
Of course, if you can see your way to convincing the Senate to change their mind, then of course we can do that sort of thing. Go and make that happen and we'll get QRCodes underway.


11 January 16 8:44 am
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Post Re: What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
ziggiau wrote:
I love my NSW survey markers, but loading a map with 3927 finds can get quite laggy. Is there a way to better manage the locationless caches that have volume like this? I use the map to check if the marker has already been logged to save time when logging. Otherwise I create the log, find a clash, then have to delete.

Or maybe a search facility by coords for locationless (I know this is available for regular caches)?

And is there a way that you can farm out some of the mundane tasks that you guys do to free your time up to do the stuff that the rest of us can't do? Spread the load? I know I'm going to spend more time on the wiki this year because that's something I can manage.

viewtopic.php?p=214886#p214886


12 January 16 1:57 pm
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Post Re: What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
WazzaAndWenches wrote:
I love the idea of History Cache. Particularly if there is a timeout and multiple question/answer possibilities.

Geocaching Australia wrote:
What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
1. The ability to add gallery items during the log stage rather than as an extra few steps.
2. An app for "i" devices. Yep, I know someone external is currently playing around with a new GC app and is looking into adding GCA functionality. The sooner, the better.

viewtopic.php?p=214887#p214887


12 January 16 1:58 pm
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Post Re: What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
A suggested format for the ‘Historic’ Caches
In the ‘Hide a Cache’ screen add an extra text box with pre-formatted fields for the Hiding Team to set three questions, each with four multiple choice answer options incorporating radio buttons.
(This text box is ‘greyed out’ unless the Cache Type ‘Historic’ is selected)
Many historic locations have plaques so the questions can be as simple as –
• The number of letters in the second word of the third line
• The number of words in the fifth line
• The number of lines in the body of the plaque
Some towns like Echuca have a main street dotted with plaques so this could be fertile ground for multiple caches
The Finding Team logs the find as usual and answers the questions by selecting the radio buttons.
Any log with an incorrect answer is recorded as a DNF and the ability to ‘delete’ logs disabled for ‘Historic’ caches to discourage ‘armchair guesses’ or alert the CO if something has changed at gz.
Over to the programming Gurus to say if this can be coded or adapted into a workable format and to the GCA family for comment and/or input.


12 January 16 8:56 pm
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Post Re: What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
That's the idea. When a history cache is identified, the Q&A section is revealed to provide the Q&A's. You can have as many questions as you like with a minimum of 1.

As far as logging, I'm thinking that you "pre-qualify". i.e. You (as the finder) answer the questions. When you get them all correct you get a code which is used on your log to signify you qualified to log a find. The code will be individual, so you can't share codes. Obviously you can share answers but we can't stop that. I personally think a punitive DNF is too restrictive. Restricting deletion of DNF logs would also be a nightmare. As you can do anything you want with logs at the moment we would need to provide special code to do that and I'm not liking the idea of the ability to edit / change / delete only under certain circumstances.


13 January 16 8:04 am
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Post Re: What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
caughtatwork wrote:
WazzaAndWenches wrote:
1. The ability to add gallery items during the log stage rather than as an extra few steps.

viewtopic.php?p=214887#p214887

Yay, works well, certainly quicker for locationless logging.


13 January 16 4:25 pm
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Post Re: What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
That's the idea. When a history cache is identified, the Q&A section is revealed to provide the Q&A's. You can have as many questions as you like with a minimum of 1.

As far as logging, I'm thinking that you "pre-qualify". i.e. You (as the finder) answer the questions. When you get them all correct you get a code which is used on your log to signify you qualified to log a find. The code will be individual, so you can't share codes. Obviously you can share answers but we can't stop that. I personally think a punitive DNF is too restrictive. Restricting deletion of DNF logs would also be a nightmare. As you can do anything you want with logs at the moment we would need to provide special code to do that and I'm not liking the idea of the ability to edit / change / delete only under certain circumstances.

OK, but how would you stop repeated guessing, a time delay or not bother?

Do you plan to put this concept on the programmers 'to do' list?
I think it could be quite popular


13 January 16 8:39 pm
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Post Re: What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
Team Ladava wrote:
That's the idea. When a history cache is identified, the Q&A section is revealed to provide the Q&A's. You can have as many questions as you like with a minimum of 1.

As far as logging, I'm thinking that you "pre-qualify". i.e. You (as the finder) answer the questions. When you get them all correct you get a code which is used on your log to signify you qualified to log a find. The code will be individual, so you can't share codes. Obviously you can share answers but we can't stop that. I personally think a punitive DNF is too restrictive. Restricting deletion of DNF logs would also be a nightmare. As you can do anything you want with logs at the moment we would need to provide special code to do that and I'm not liking the idea of the ability to edit / change / delete only under certain circumstances.

OK, but how would you stop repeated guessing, a time delay or not bother?

Do you plan to put this concept on the programmers 'to do' list?
I think it could be quite popular

Nothing can stop the guesser. There is talk of a time delay for each incorrect answer submission and I need to look at what is reasonable to stop a guesser vs. someone who ticked the wrong box but knows the right answer. If people have other thoughts and opinions this is the time for discussion otherwise I'll start designing what we have so far.


14 January 16 8:07 am
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Post Re: What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
I don't think we should spend too much time defeating cheaters. Cheaters will cheat, regardless of the amount of checks, balances, etc you put in. Have faith that 99% of people will do the right thing. The community can sort out the 1% of cheaters ourselves.


14 January 16 11:46 am
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Post Re: What can Geocaching Australia do for you in 2016?
Then why have Q&A at all? Just assume they did the history cache? Assume they completed the puzzle and just give them the co-ords? We can't stop all cheaters but we should still have requirements for certain cache types that should be met.


14 January 16 11:52 am
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